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Which system do you prefer?

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Total Votes : 13

Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by KaRei on Mon Nov 10, 2014 10:11 am

PFFFFFFTTTT i didn't even notice this topic til now (be late to everything!)

i barely know anything, but i can try to give decent feedback to the best of my ability with my untrained ears? QAQ  i'm usually hesitant on giving constructive criticism when it comes to the more technical aspects like mixing and animating, since i'm a novice >___> 

i think this is a wonderful idea, though.  not only does it help those out who really want the feedback and constructive criticism to help themselves improve, but it also brings everyone together as a true community to help each other out.
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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by Aerlith on Mon Nov 10, 2014 1:53 pm

You can always work your way up to the higher levels of critique. We don't expect everyone to be able to do an in-depth critique right from the start. The badges will be around from now on, so they won't be here for only a limited amount of time.

And glad you like the idea! That was pretty much the main reason why we started this. :Db

(If you have suggestions for more exposure, I'll gladly take them. I advertised it on FB and put it in the sidebar, announcements, and everything, but I think not everyone has noticed still XD)

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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by sonic-nancy-fan on Mon Nov 10, 2014 2:16 pm

DefectRila wrote:Question(err maybe suggestion): Is it possible for higher critiques to be cumulative? For example, A higher critique can count as a lower one for a lower badge if a person desires but cannot be reused for a higher badge.
Like say they want to do 4 small critiques and the last one happens to be a large one. or another situation would be like, instead of doing 5 small, 5 mid, and 5 large, someone might want to do 15 large ones or something.

Pretty much TL;DR
Larger ones can count as smaller ones but smaller ones cant count as larger ones
like a medium or large can count as a small but a small cant count for anything else.

Just saying this because there might be times when people are limited because they might be bribed by a badge.

Just throwing out a potential thingg.

I know that this has not been discussed yet since your laptop has not been fixed. I just thought I would give my opinion.

Personally, I would feel bad giving 5 people in-depth reviews and then giving some other people ghetto reviews. I would like to write in-depth or at least intermediate review for everyone instead of having to give someone less feedback just to get a badge.

A more concrete reason as to why it should be allowed. If someone were to write 15 in-depth reviews, that is going to be about the size of 50 small feedbacks and about 30 intermediate feedbacks.Ha...ha...

In addition, have anyone heard of the school rule where if someone says they are drinking alcohol, even if it is just water, it will be treated like alcohol and they will get punished? In a round-about sort of way, this applies to this discussion. If someone writes 5 in-depth feedbacks yet wants to count them as the smallest feedback, that is their own decision.

Switching topics, something about this thread does not seem right to me
http://ytchorus.forumotion.com/t6267-feedback-badges-november-11-1-11-30

To get a badge, one must write 5 reviews in one month... are you serious?
It is not how many reviews one has to write that bothers me. What bothers me is the fact that there is a deadline for critique. Some people take longer than others to write a review, especially an in-depth review.

A review/feedback is meant to give advice, criticism, and encouragement. Giving badges is supposed to motivate people to give critique. However, the point of this thread is to "bribe encourage everyone to become more involved in each other's work."
Here is the problem, with the motivation of a badge and a deadline, people may be more likely to just give random/stupid/ignorant/redundant/(insert here) feedback that still meet the requirements. Not to say that all people will do this, but the deadline is always looming over people as they write feedback and may subconsciously make people do a worse/more rushed job had if they did not have a deadline.

Unlike the monthly theme which was designed to make the forums more active, this is designed to help the members of the forum. The monthly theme has a deadline as a means of making people active. This thread has no true reason to have a deadline, at least non that I can think of.
Of course, if someone writes two reviews and comes back a year later and writes three more, then that may be a problem. However, that problem would be easy to fix since everyone has to post links to their feedback posts. It is easy to check the dates of posts, especially since someone has to check and see if the reviews match the requirements.

Wow, that was practically a review itself. Sorry for making this post so long. Hyper

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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by Aerlith on Mon Nov 10, 2014 2:41 pm

More stuff to discuss with the mod team! xD Thanks! I'll post a quick reply though regarding some of the points of you brought up.

The point of the deadline is to make people active in each other's work, too. If you aren't able to meet it this month, you can always try for the next month. And based on what we've seen already, most people who are posting feedback are able to hit five with in the month. I see no reason to change it? If we were to set no deadline though, then we'd have to increase the minimum for the badge. No way am I going to let just five critiques be the badge. It would have to be a higher number, like 20 to 30. People need to put work into the badges. That's part of the reason why you need to hit it in a month. If you aren't able to hit it in that month, you can always try again.

Personally, I don't see why we should allow for the higher level critiques to be used for the lower level critiques. They are different levels and should be treated as such. There is also no reason why you can't continue doing higher level critiques once you get the badge. Some people may not even want in-depth critiques.

But again, that'd have to be something that we discuss as a mod team.

An alternative is to make each of these feedbacks add up to a series of points. 1 point per basic, 2 per intermediate, 3 per advanced. Then you need X amount of points to get one of the badges.

Then it'd be something like, 20 for the first badge, 50 for the second, 100 for the third.

I'm up for revising this, but only if it's... reasonable?

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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by KaRei on Mon Nov 10, 2014 2:51 pm

oh, i don't know if maybe this was already stated earlier and i just missed it, if so, i'm sorry >___<  but say, if you obtained a badge one month, but the next month you didn't for whatever reason (too busy or no internet access for an extended period of time etc), do you lose your badge? 

i think i prefer the cumulative review thing but it may mean more work for the mods in keeping track of the reviews?  if it's cumulative, then people won't feel pressured to meet the requirements each month and more thought will go into the reviews.
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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by Aerlith on Mon Nov 10, 2014 3:04 pm

You would not lose the badge, no. Once you receive the badge, it would be permanent.

And I'm looking around, and it looks like it is possible to do a point system. We could do double points for people who fulfill a request (ex. someone requests basic feedback on X work). Person who fulfills it would receive double points (2 instead of 1), person who requested it would lose 2 points instead of one. Your point total would be different from your point bank (ex. You have earned 120 points, spent 65, so you can use 55 points still). Earning a badge would come from your total amount of earned points versus how many points you have available.

So you could use the points to buy feedback?? Or at least request feedback. The work would not need to be complete either, so you could either link to a WIP or a completed version. We would need to create a separate forum if this were the case. We tried this at a writing forum I was part of, and it worked pretty well.

So yeah, that would be an alternative instead of the monthly 5 feedbacks for a badge.

The only issue is that it's a lot of work since we'd have to manually edit points, and pretty sure I'll be the only one who can do the editing since no one else has access to the mod panel. <.<; May be able to work out a way for the moderators to figure it out, too.

Anyway! Other members of the forum! Please feel free to discuss since this will affect everyone!

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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by KaRei on Mon Nov 10, 2014 3:10 pm

ooh i like that idea of using the points as currency.  i hope you work out a way so that the mods can help you out >___<
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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by sonic-nancy-fan on Mon Nov 10, 2014 3:19 pm

" Person who fulfills it would receive double points (2 instead of 1), person who requested it would lose 2 points instead of one."

This perplexes me.

If someone has no idea what any of this is yet they request feedback, will they have negative points?

I can leave basic feedback that hardly does anything if someone requests it and then they will lose points?

Why does the person wanting feedback lose points? What is the point *bad pun*? Why not just have someone how leaves a review gets points.

It just seems odd that someone would essentially be bribing someone to take a look at their stuff and leave their feedback yet also be losing something at the same time.

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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by Aerlith on Mon Nov 10, 2014 6:29 pm

You spend the points to ask for a specific feedback. So yes, if you want something in particular, I think you should have to use up something in order to get it. It would be pretty easy to earn points, so I don't think this should be a huge issue. You don't have to wait for someone to request feedback in order to earn points.

You're receiving feedback for something you're asking help on, so yeah, I think you should have to lose something. It is also incentive for people to give feedback to other people so they don't run out of points. Otherwise we'll just have a bunch of points... sitting there and not really doing anything.

Like I said though, this is still an alternative to the current monthly feedback system --> get feedback, so it's not necessarily something we HAVE to implement.

//edit:

I forgot to add that the person would have to SPECIFICALLY request a type of feedback. So for example: Requesting In-Depth Critique for a Cover. You can also request what you want people to pay attention to, but the important thing is the In-Depth, Basic, or Intermediate label.

You would not get the double points if you only give a basic feedback or intermediate feedback. You would not end up taking points away from the person either. The points would only go to you if you give the in-depth critique on the specific thing that is being requested.

Should also remind you guys that this goes for not just covers or translyrics, but things like cosplays, art, writing.


Last edited by Aerlith on Mon Nov 10, 2014 9:08 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by Shinra on Mon Nov 10, 2014 8:50 pm

Brought up a few points with Aer about how to determine what critique fits the criteria of what feedback tier. Among other things.

TLDR; I support point system.

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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by DefectRila on Mon Nov 10, 2014 9:00 pm

Suggesting For point system:
(This is under the assumption that we're doing this manually)

A Thread created for mods to check the initial point earnings (One that doesnt use request, and where the points are passed out).
People will have to post their feedbacks to the mods using an entry form for their things to be reviewed. Mods will go through it and delete and add/confirm the feedbacks as they come in. 

The main post would have a scoreboard that archives the feedbacks earned or any changes to the system or whatnot. A new thread can be created monthly.

Entry forms would prob have to include like spoiler quotes or something along with like link to page(?) and the desired level of feedback(?)

If people do not bring in their feedback within the month it was posted it can be dismissed and they wont earn points for it(?)

Requesting feedbacks can have its own individual subforum and would require indication of some sort as to who is getting the points paid to by the OP. (If there are no indications and requests are continued to be made, this can be a violation? IDK) Mods can sift through these cause there will most likely be an indication as to who contributed the main request which in turn the mod would mark it as confirmed and either throw it into archives(?) or leave it there for the remaining month(?)
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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by Aerlith on Mon Nov 10, 2014 9:22 pm

I HAD MORE TIME TO DIGEST AND DISCUSSED WITH SHINRA AND REI THROUGH SHINRA SO HERE IS AN UPDATE TO THE POINT SYSTEM IF WE DO USE IT.

First off, there would be two categories for the points.

Total Points Earned: 57 <-- This is the number of points that goes towards the badges. You do NOT have to buy the badges individually. Once you hit the tier, you will earn the badge. We do request that you notify us WHEN you hit the number though. At 57, this person would be eligible for both the Kaito badge and the Luka badge.
Total Available Points for Spending: 17 <-- This is the number of points you have available to request feedback. This number means that the person has already spent 40 points requesting feedback (and has ALSO received the requested feedback).

Everyone who is currently signed up and has a portfolio will start off with 5 points. Everyone else after that will get 3 points after they post an intro thread, 2 points for a portfolio thread.

Yes. I am making them post an intro thread because it's 1) easy way to keep track of people, 2) We actually get to meet them.

Regarding the portfolios, if we do this, everyone on the forum will have a week to make their portfolios before we award the five points. This means that any new members that join during that week will NOT get an extra three points for posting an intro thread. I am opting for this option instead of giving EVERY SINGLE PERSON five points 'cause we'd have to manually do that, and even with the help of the mods, it'd still take us a good day or two. And especially since a lot of people are inactive... waste of time. It is better for us to know that people are willing to take the effort to make a portfolio first, too.

Anyway, we would have a separate category for anything that can get points for feedback. Category would have boards: one each for covers, translyrics, writing, and art. Then there would be a board above all of that (in the Feedback board still) that will be for requests.

EACH INDIVIDUAL REQUEST FOR FEEDBACK WILL BE ONE THREAD. So me specifying that I want feedback for say.. a story. One thread. If I want feedback for something else, make a new thread. If someone wants to give feedback, they need to complete the feedback in the designated portfolio first and then POST IN THE THREAD with a link to their feedback. They will then link that post to the monthly feedback thread.

To address what Rei said, making a thread for requesting feedback would be mandatory. If we do not see a thread and someone claims that they are fulfilling a request, they will NOT get the double points. They will still get the regular points, just wouldn't be double.

In order to make a request, I would need the amount of points needed to pay for the request. So say I want an in-depth critique for my daze cover, if I only have five points, I CANNOT request it. Requested feedbacks take double the points, so I would need SIX points. I would have to give feedback to someone first before I have enough points for the requested in-depth.

If you do not have enough points to request feedback, your thread will be locked/denied. Alternatively we could also delete it, but I feel like if someone really wants to give feedback on something and not receive the double points for it, they can do that.

As mentioned, there would be a monthly thread for people to turn in their feedback, along with a form. If it is a requested feedback, they will have to LINK to the specific request thread that they fulfilled. Mods will take a look at the feedback, see that it fits the one that the person says they are doing, then award/take points away as necessary. They would edit the original feedback post to say that the points have been given (Reason for Edit: +3 points for in-depth feedback; +6 points for doing a requested in-depth feedback, -6 points for requesting a in-depth feedback), THEN POST that they have awarded points. This is to prevent any cheating from happening, where someone can delete the "Reason for editing" in their posts.

You would need to POST the link to your feedback in the monthly feedback thread. It is unfair to mods to have them have to comb through posts to award the points.

Also, Shinra and I checked, and mods are able to also award points..! So yay. That will make it much easier.

If the request has been fulfilled, it will be moved to a "Finished Requests" subboard. If anyone else gives feedback on a fulfilled request, they will NOT receive double points, and the person who wanted the request will NOT lose any points. If someone wants multiple people to give feedback, they would need to tell us in the thread AND have enough points to pay for it. So for example, if I want three people to give me an intermediate feedback for a cover, I can specify it in my thread. Then each time someone fulfills a request, I'll give them four points and they will receive four points. Second person who fulfills request will still get four points, third person will get four points.

I should also mention that you are free to give feedback to people who DO NOT request feedback. You just wouldn't get the double points.

OKAY. How does that sound? I know it sounds a bit complicated, so we can always try a trial run first?

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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by KaRei on Tue Nov 11, 2014 7:11 am

it does sound a bit complicated, but from what i understand, it sounds good to me so far.  i just want to make sure i understand everything correctly:

if you want to request feedback for a particular piece of work, do you also HAVE to post it in your portfolio?  even if it's unfinished and you just want some opinions so you can fix things or make adjustments or you just don't want to post it in your portfolio?
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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by Aerlith on Tue Nov 11, 2014 7:58 am

If it's unfinished, you would not have to post it in your portfolio. You can just link it in the thread.

This one part I'm not sure about though -annoys everyone else-. I was thinking it would be easier if the feedback is all in one place, so even for WIPs, feedback can still go in the portfolio. Or would it make more sense for WIP feedback to go in the request thread? I'm worried it'd confused people? xD

So thinking the feedback itself should still go in the portfolio, even for a WIP. The WIP link does not have to be in the portfolio though. Just needs to be in the request thread.

Does that clear it up? Minus the additional question I brought up.

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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by sonic-nancy-fan on Tue Nov 11, 2014 2:04 pm

Aerlith wrote:As mentioned, there would be a monthly thread for people to turn in their feedback, along with a form. If it is a requested feedback, they will have to LINK to the specific request thread that they fulfilled. Mods will take a look at the feedback, see that it fits the one that the person says they are doing, then award/take points away as necessary. They would edit the original feedback post to say that the points have been given (Reason for Edit: +3 points for in-depth feedback; +6 points for doing a requested in-depth feedback, -6 points for requesting a in-depth feedback), THEN POST that they have awarded points. This is to prevent any cheating from happening, where someone can delete the "Reason for editing" in their posts.

Okay, I want to make sure I understand this.

Each person keeps track of their own feedback and then links to it in the feedback thread for that month, right?

Does a person need to do a review every month to keep their points or can a month be skipped?

If someone has 20 points, gets the first badge, then uses some points, do they still keep the badge? I am assuming they do, but I thought I would ask to make sure.

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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by Aerlith on Tue Nov 11, 2014 4:36 pm

Month can be skipped! c: So if you don't do any feedback for a month, you'd still keep your points.

Yep, you need to keep track of your feedback and link it. You can link it each time you are done with a round of feedback (if you only plan on doing one at a time, you can just do one at a time). You would not need to wait until the end of the month to link to ALL of your feedback posts.

The amount of points available would be in your profile, so you can see how many points you have. You should expect some delay in updating though, since the mods aren't able to be on the forums 24/7.

They will still be able to keep the badge. The total points earned goes towards the badge. The total points available would be what you can spend. So yeah, as long as your total points earned is higher than what is required for the badge, you should have the badge.

Doessssss that help?

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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by sonic-nancy-fan on Wed Nov 12, 2014 12:18 pm

Yes~ You are very good at explaining things.XD

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sonic-nancy-fan
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Singing Alias : Joker Female
Posts : 352
Join date : 2013-08-04
Age : 20
Location : Indiana

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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by Aerlith on Wed Nov 12, 2014 7:59 pm

I'll set up a poll so we can decide which system to use then! Smile I'll give it until the weekend to decide which one we'll settle with.

Thanks for all your feedback, everyone!

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Aerlith
Forever messing with staff.
Forever messing with staff.

Singing Alias : Aerlith Posts : 1953
Join date : 2013-03-16
I'm on the spice rack! Raidcall Train Participant Ai Kotoba II Chorus Ai Kotoba II Words Blind Duets Judge SMILING Participant Tako Luka Maguro Fever Event Participant Box of Cheer ٩๏̯͡๏۶ Participant Monthly Theme Participant (1/4) Monthly Theme Participant (2/4) Monthly Theme Participant (3/4) Monthly Theme Participant (4/4)

http://www.youtube.com/user/xAerlith

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Re: Feedback Badges!

Post by Aerlith on Sat Nov 15, 2014 9:47 am

All right, looks like we're going with the points system. Thanks for your votes, everyone! ^_^

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We are in the process of awarding everyone who has at least one portfolio five points. If you have not yet made a portfolio, you have a week to do so (until November 22, 2014). After that, you will only receive two points for creating a portfolio if you registered before November 14, 2014.

If you registered after November 14, 2014, you will receive three points for creating an introduction thread and two points for creating your first portfolio in either Covers, Translyrics, Writing, or Art.

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Aerlith
Forever messing with staff.
Forever messing with staff.

Singing Alias : Aerlith Posts : 1953
Join date : 2013-03-16
I'm on the spice rack! Raidcall Train Participant Ai Kotoba II Chorus Ai Kotoba II Words Blind Duets Judge SMILING Participant Tako Luka Maguro Fever Event Participant Box of Cheer ٩๏̯͡๏۶ Participant Monthly Theme Participant (1/4) Monthly Theme Participant (2/4) Monthly Theme Participant (3/4) Monthly Theme Participant (4/4)

http://www.youtube.com/user/xAerlith

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Re: Feedback Badges!

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