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To all yunomi fans:

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To all yunomi fans: Empty To all yunomi fans:

Post by Guest on Mon Aug 02, 2010 7:24 am


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Post by yanovi on Mon Aug 02, 2010 9:01 am

AHHHHHHHHHH

okay, some of them i can understand. Like the backgrounds, ipod, husky, etc~ (because that's okay, imo, as long as the image wasn't copywrite.. >3> )

but AHHHHHHHHH most of them are really undeniable |||OTL
Spoiler:
To all yunomi fans: 4d763bf9

TT3TT

brb crying heavyly.
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Post by Paprika on Mon Aug 02, 2010 9:23 am

You know, this isn't all too bad. Using references to draw artworks isn't dishonorable in the slightest; they help everyone regardless of skill.

And some of the references are honestly retarded. iPod and Guitar? Please. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that even if she traced them IMO.

But of course, some of the body poses look 100% traced and I have to admit that pretty eh for me. If they weren't commercial products and she gave a source, then it'd be A-OK just because it's regular art with cited information...

Gah. Selling it is a whole other story though. I really don't like that.

tl;dr I think it's fine until you sell them under the impression all content is yours.
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Post by ☆ mei on Mon Aug 02, 2010 10:03 am

Uhm, what happened..... ;A;
/cannot understand Japanese

//edit: Nevermind....
I don't know what to think.
References are perfectly fine imo, but taking photos/items, putting them in and adding no credit seems questionable to me. ouo;;;

But then again I don't take such matters as seriously as some people, so idk. -shrugs-
Yunomi is Yunomi and I still love her art. XD
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Post by yanovi on Mon Aug 02, 2010 10:53 am

omg, inner illust-demon coming out.

referencing and tracing/eye-balling are two TOTALLY different things. reference is a guide to help you, eye-balling is a crutch that limits you.

this is referencing http://livedoor.2.blogimg.jp/insidears/imgs/7/1/71355eac.jpg
this is eyeballing/tracing http://livedoor.2.blogimg.jp/insidears/imgs/b/0/b0c183c9.jpg

she sells artbooks and the works are on covers of multiple CDs. and usually people reference for improvement, not to claim as their own work. T3T);;; so dishonest~

and she's like my hero ahhhh
but... can't. not. hate. her.
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Post by ☆ mei on Mon Aug 02, 2010 12:52 pm

yeah the selling stuff is quite questionable too orz
sorry if I seem ignorant about all the artsy stuff, I don't spend a lot of my time on dA or any kind of artsite except pixiv xD;;

that eyeballing picture is... ene. lol woooow.
wonder how things shall turn out o3o;
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Post by Guest on Mon Aug 02, 2010 12:58 pm

yanovi wrote:
and she's like my hero ahhhh
but... can't. not. hate. her.

S-same here Yano...orz
Let's cry together ; A ;

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Post by Guest on Mon Aug 02, 2010 1:57 pm

Ooo, this is very scandalousss.

I wouldn't really mind too much about the similar poses and stuff, except for the fact that Yunomi's art is profitable, as everyone else has said before. Honestly, I really don't mind about the eyeballed--and to some extent, even the traced--poses, however, that whole "image background copy and paste" stuff really had me going are you serious?.

Of course, unless Yunomi had referenced and sited back where the background image, and basically every picture she referenced was from, then maybe this whole issue wouldn't be so severe. Then again, I can't read Japanese, and so I don't know if Yunomi's actually credited pictures she's referenced off of. (Judging from that whole page whole of scandalous stuff, that answer would be a big, fat "no, of course she hasn't credited".)

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Post by kuri-n on Tue Aug 03, 2010 5:06 am

To be honest I didn't really mind the usage of stock photos. But the tracing really REALLY bugged me.

Seriously, these 2chan people need to get a life. WTH?! Going through all that trouble to catch her tracing. Because of that all the videos on nico with her art are getting bashed on. ;^; [well i get why they would do that, but seriously. Even with the iPod in one of her JBF images? please.]

It's such a shame that magnet got taken down because of this issue. ;^;

But yunomi is a good artist. Minus the tracing. ;A;
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Post by kiki on Tue Aug 03, 2010 7:37 am

it seems we can't access magnet and just be friends anymore all because of hate comments flying around in the videos..

The uploaders have now private those videos because of that

and..OH LOOK THEY MADE A VIDEO ABOUT IT TO TELL THE WHOLE WORLD

Shame on you whoever started this..anyway I'll still love Yunomi no matter what XD
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Post by Guest on Tue Aug 03, 2010 12:57 pm

Wow... all the videos that Yunomi's art is featured in on Nico are entirely spammed with hate comments too, like Cendrillon.

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Post by yanovi on Tue Aug 03, 2010 1:25 pm

formal apology that i cannot understand~
http://yunomi.blog.shinobi.jp/Entry/104/
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Post by AnotherNicoUploader on Tue Aug 03, 2010 1:49 pm

Of course Yunomi of all people doing this isn't good at all, but I think everyone else is getting a bit fanatical over this. Just a couple of those images would be more than enough, but going and collecting everything there is just ridiculous. I mean, look at these...

Spoiler:
To all yunomi fans: A7e33b83

O MAI GAWD IT'S A GIRL IN A SCHOOL OUTFIT ON A TRAIN THOSE ARE SO RARE IT MUST BE COMPLETELY RIPPED OFF

Spoiler:
To all yunomi fans: 118dfdab

A woman casually playing electric guitar? That's not too rar- HOLY CRAP LOOK SHE'S ON A CHAIR IT'S TOTALLY COPYING

Spoiler:
To all yunomi fans: 9fa615dc

Two people on a bike.

I'm not even gonna comment on this one.

Spoiler:
To all yunomi fans: 8d6af558

woah woah woah hold it

Not even a moment's thought of a nice, clean reference? If it's THIS IDENTICAL, there's not even a sliver of a chance it might be a tribute instead of a total rip-off?

(stuff's probably going to be cut off 'cause of the width limit but yeah you can see what I'm talking about)

Now, just outright attacking the videos on Nico featuring her art is worse. A thousnd comments telling her to die isn't going to solve anything, and making the video private or taking it down because of it just makes things worse. The producers really haven't done anything and they're getting hit hard from this too, which screws over the fans.

asdvsfs. If this stuff was just addressed privately, there wouldn't be all this haet flying around.

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Post by yanovi on Tue Aug 03, 2010 4:01 pm

actually..
@ANU's bike comment
http://livedoor.2.blogimg.jp/insidears/imgs/0/b/0b64af17-s.jpg
8D;;;; people have a lot of time on their hands~


but yeah, i feel bad for her
magnet & JBF being hidden is AHHH~
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Post by Guest on Wed Aug 04, 2010 2:15 am

Maybe she traced and all...but still, I think she's awesome.
I follow her on twitter and I've seen some sketches.
And her painting is awesome D=

NO WAY JBF & MAGNET HIDDEN? AAAAAAAA ;; A ;;

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Post by Aniki on Wed Aug 04, 2010 2:45 am

This is... kinda silly, imo...

Having dabbled in the art world, and DA, I know how fickly art and ownership can be... but really, how much is original anymore?

Honestly, people are making this, far worse than it really is.

Yes, she traced, and that is what irks me, and other people. However, when it comes to referencing, poses, stock photos, image backgrounds, the complications behind everything get even more confusing.

Yes, she has put her art on sale. However, it all depends whether she traced, referenced, or used an image in her work.

Images she's traced, shouldn't be sold. Posted, might be a different matter, there are a whole bunch of complications with claiming and stuff.... not gonna delve into that.

As for referenced images... there are a limited number of poses a human body can do... and a limited angle choices... sooner, rather than later, someone's gonna make the same pose as someone else, or draw the same pose as the next person. It seems, she referenced a lot of her poses of stock images. And really, I don't see the problem with that. I don't think it's particularly worth it to start fights over a pose... gawd, it's a person, sooner or later, someone's gonna do the same thing.

Finally, images for background. People are really anal about their photos being taken. And there's a whole bunch of debate of images belong to who and what not, photographers, and photos being art. If she used a photo from a photographer without their permission, breaching their terms of use, then it's her fault. Even if it is stock photo. But it all comes down to the terms of use of the photographer. If they allow her to sell her work with their photos without credit, then it's up to them. But if not, then she's the one at fault...

All in all, I think people are making too big a deal out of it, and finding silly examples for comparison.
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Post by Kayuri Hiwatari on Wed Aug 04, 2010 9:13 pm

I agree with others. Seriously, some of the examples they're trying to compare to are really out there, while others are blatantly obvious. I'm not really going to give my opinion on the matter because it's during times like these, I sometimes wonder how ironic 「Smiling」 is & it's line "No Time To Hate!!" ) : Where's the NicoNico in NicoNico Douga guys? Crying
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Post by Variegeta on Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:01 pm

I've heard of this news, but I am in fact not really surprised by this. This is 2ch after all, which to me, has always been the original hate machine, because many people really have nothing else to do. One of the first I've seen was the song by a Chinese Vocaloid producer being bashed at and insulted for producing a song of Miku singing beautifully in Chinese, that he had to delete it. The Smiling and NicoNico reference had been mentioned but it was too late.

I believe it's too late for this situation as well.
Of course, this isn't the first or last time something like this will happen, sadly.

yanovi wrote:formal apology that i cannot understand~
http://yunomi.blog.shinobi.jp/Entry/104/

A rough translation from DeviantArt in a Vocaloid group:

Spoiler:
To everyone,

I know that my past works have caused problems, so I offer my apologies.
I'm truly sorry.

To many Ps, fans,audiences, and those who have worried about me that sent me reports that were delayed, I'm sorry that I have to reply this way.

I'm taking in all your comments quietly.
Currently, I think there are many stories about what the truth is. There are false stories out there, but including those stories, I don't intend to have excuses for them either.
Right now people point out my careless behavior, the behavior responsible, and I'm ashamed of it and I'm regretting it very much.

Also, all the past productions, composers, companies, and all others involved are not involved, so please don't send reports about me to them.

As for other activities, I don't want to be an inconvenience for everybody, I'll take responsibility and decided to refrain from future activities.

Once more, I'm the one responsible for this. Please refrain from posting comments about me or my work on various composers' and companies' videos.

I'll apologize once more.
I'm very sorry.

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Post by Mr0ctober on Wed Aug 04, 2010 11:34 pm

I can imagine all the legal infractions that people can pull up because of this. To me, this situation itself isn't that much if a deal. The artist didn't do this for the profit rather for the fans of vocaloids.
There's much worse people out there that denies flat out they didn't copy even though evidence has been played out right in front of them (if anyone likes to recall that Bleach incident). Also China has a really bad rep for stealing anything including the artwork from "5 Centimeters Per Second" and the people of DA and selling as their own. Yet we don't find anything happening to them. So they escape scott-free. Looking at you China.

Look at these examples:
Spoiler:
To all yunomi fans: Huh10
To all yunomi fans: 71213_10
To all yunomi fans: 71209_10
To all yunomi fans: Coince10
To all yunomi fans: 26731_11
I bet any drawings we can find something that looks similar or exactly posed similarly. So to me, this little accident is just trivial and by far she's sincere in her apologies.

Oh yes, let me add what China did with the movie "5 Centimeters Per Second"
Spoiler:
To all yunomi fans: Copy1
To all yunomi fans: Copy2
To all yunomi fans: Copy3
To all yunomi fans: Copy4
They also made money from it . . .

Don't know about this one . . .:
Spoiler:
To all yunomi fans: 71217_10
Just for the lol's
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Post by Imagase on Fri Aug 06, 2010 7:25 am

thank goodness I was never a fan from the start :3
xDDDD

daijoubu *thumbs up* STUFFS HAPPENS =A=
and yeah, some of it people are just bullcrapping all over.
it shouldn't be label as copy infringment!, but some are like 100% taken from the refference so, it can't be said. :/

best luck to yunomi, maybe she'll think twice, now knowing, how bad the haters out there are..

But honestly... come on, get real. There can only be so many poses, that people ARE bound to redraw it.

COME ON I am serious...

To all yunomi fans: Cowboybebopvsnaruto


FOR REALS MAN. :3 I love how EARTH recycles things :3


Last edited by Megane on Fri Aug 06, 2010 8:29 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Post by mong on Fri Aug 06, 2010 9:26 am

...I'm still not changing my icon. /too lazy

But lol, while she did very obviously copy/trace some things, the other stuff isn't really something to call copyright infringement over. Shouldn't have been such a huge huge issue over this as it did, but then again, she's popular. I just wish people would stop spamming the videos with her art in it. Her rep's ruined already, there's no need to repeatedly ram the fact in and in the process bring other people down with her. >:

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Post by Ciel on Fri Aug 06, 2010 4:47 pm

Mr0ctober wrote:I can imagine all the legal infractions that people can pull up because of this. To me, this situation itself isn't that much if a deal. The artist didn't do this for the profit rather for the fans of vocaloids.

That's where the problem lies. Most of Yunomi's work are profit earning things. Like album covers, even designing characters for events, things like that.

Honestly, I can see why it's hard for actual Yunomi fans to accept, but let's face it - she did something stupid and tried to pass it off as her own.

I think the biggest issue I have is the fact that she was quoted saying (paraphrased btw), "When I get a request for a PV, I sit and listen to the song, and draw out a whole bunch of rought just from what's in my head".

a....hahaha...nice try.

My issue is that she's not even a bad artist, why did she have to resort to that :/.
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Post by Guest on Fri Aug 06, 2010 6:25 pm

Ciel wrote:I think the biggest issue I have is the fact that she was quoted saying (paraphrased btw), "When I get a request for a PV, I sit and listen to the song, and draw out a whole bunch of rought just from what's in my head".
Ahh.

That's probably why haters are hating more than usual, like spamming every art-related videos of hers with angry comments. The usual haters would've just tried with all their might to list as many examples of copying/tracing Yunomi has done, even if their examples end up a bit ludicrous. However, I think it's the fact that Yunomi herself was arrogant of her artwork, to the point of down right lying about it (hence the quote about her PV art, where most of them like Magnet and Just Be Friends were proven to be mostly traced and "stolen" stock art) that has caused an outrage, gaining her even more haters. Of course, the major reason is still the issues involving copyright infringement.

I'm just speculating, but maybe she had an artist block and couldn't figure anyway to draw new poses--or maybe that she sometimes has problems drawing, anatomy-wise--so that's why she resolved to copying/tracing. And it's also the fact that a lot of poses just look similar to each other. Though, from the looks of it, a lot of her pictures fall victim to being traced/copied; many people (I'm thinking in a "hater's" sort of perspective) would have to question her real art ability and how she doesn't deserve to have so much recognition from mostly "stolen art". Actually, a question: does Yunomi actually earn money from all those album covers and posters and whatever else she's done? I would think it'd be a "yes, she does earn money", but I'm not so truly sure.

BIG GIANT WALL OF TEXT, I'M SORRY. I LIKE TO TYPE, THAT'S ALL. Sad

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Post by Ciel on Fri Aug 06, 2010 6:31 pm

In the case of album artwork, she gets a cut of whatever the P makes from it. It's the general thing from all the P's I know - a portion of it goes to the artist for the design and artwork. Like meola gets a cut from yuyoyuppe's stuff, things like that. They don't make BIG money or anything, so it's not like a significant amount haha. They don't get paid, more like, just the part of whatever is earned. That's how doujin circles work after all.

What she definitely earns from is the artbooks she sells though.

I think arguing that it's artist block is a lousy reason. If you're a well-known enough artist and say "I have an artist block, I might take a bit longer", no one's going to force you to draw on time because they think OH MY GOD IT'S ~THAT~ AMAZING ARTIST I CAN'T FORCE HER TO DRAW FOR ME OMGOMG. Basically. Also the fact that a huge majority of it is blatant tracing (I mean, c'mon, there was one where she traced the pose and the guitar, and didn't alter a THING about the guitar whatsoever...at least change the lighting and make it less suspicious y'know), that it's not really something you can pass as just an artist block?


I'm just upset that as a result of this, a lot of stupid people are now roaming around other popular (and not so) artists and heckling the videos with "oh maybe this was traced". Like my friend Karu (the one who did the art for this and this) is getting lot of "omg maybe she traced omgomg" comments on videos and is really upset over it. It's really disrespectful for them to obsess over something stupid like this and cause trouble for people who aren't even related :/. Like the fact the P's are getting crap for it as well.
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Post by Guest on Fri Aug 06, 2010 7:11 pm

AH GOD HOFAHLWQ IT'S BAD THAT I'M GETTING REALLY INTO THIS ISSUE.

I'm reading other comments on other sites regarding this issue and there's more to it than just the usual "she traced her work". For example, about the stock photos and why Magnet and Just Be Friends are private:

Spoiler:
Nana wrote:Those stock photos cost money to use. "Royalty free" doesn't mean "completely free", it means pay a one time fee (not for access to the site or a monthly subscription fee, for the individual photo) to use the photo as many times as possible. (...) Considering the amount of stock images she used, a PV like JBF would have been very expensive to make... if she paid. She has not provided proof that she paid for the images. (...) However, if she did not pay for the stock images, it means that she CANNOT use them. Because the legality of those images are in question, Dixie and minato had to set their vids to private (read their statements here: http://yeheyuanstudio.com/?p=531 , http://tolie618.blog63.fc2.com/blog-entry-74.html ).
More of Nana's comments at http://www.vocaloidism.com/2010/08/04/with-regards-to-the-yunomi-incident/comment-page-1/

So using stock photos are bad, huh, and the issue will probably cause problems with minato, Dixie Flatline and their labels. This whole issue is definitely a lot more severe than what we originally thought.

Still, this is the first time I've heard of other PV artists on Nico getting hurtful rumours about their art and getting picked on. It's honestly really terrible, people getting suspicious of others based on one issue. Such disrespect...

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